Russell Benaroya, Partner and Co-founder, Stride Services
Russell Benaroya is an entrepreneur with a background in corporate finance and private equity. Prior to becoming a Partner at Stride, Russell was the Senior Vice President of Corporate Development for higi, a population health enablement company that owns the largest national network of health screening stations. In 2017, higi acquired EveryMove, a venture-backed technology start-up where Russell was the co-founder and CEO. Prior to EveryMove, Russell was the Co-Founder and Chief Executive Office of REM Medical, a multi-state sleep disorder health care business that was acquired in September 2009. Prior to REM Medical, Russell was an investment professional for the private equity firms Kline Hawkes and Blue Point Capital, where he invested in healthcare, technology, and industrial based enterprises.Russell was also an early employee at Overture Services (acquired by Yahoo in 2003), a pioneer in web-based search engine marketing.
russell.benaroya@stride.services
https://stride.services/
Russell’s direct number: +1 (206) 779 - 1359
AUTOMATED EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
[00:00:01] You're listening to Scaling Up Services where we speak with entrepreneurs authors business experts and thought leaders to give you the knowledge and insights you need to scale your service based business faster and easier. And now here is your host Business Coach Bruce Eckfeldt.
[00:00:22] Are you a CEO looking to scale your company faster and easier. Checkout Thrive Roundtable thrive combines a moderated peer group mastermind expert one on one coaching access to proven growth tools and a 24/7 support community created by Inc award winning CEO and certified scaling up business coach Bruce Eckfeldt. Thrive will help you grow your business more quickly and with less drama. For more details about the program, visit eckfeldt.com/thrive . That’s E C K F E L D T. com / thrive.
[00:00:57] Welcome everyone. This is scaling up services. I'm Bruce Eckfeldt. I'm your host. And our guest today is Russell Benaroya and his partner at Stride Services. They are bookkeeping and accounting firm. We're going to learn more about the services they provide, but more importantly, we're going to learn about the history of the company. We're gonna talk about core values. We're gonna talk about how to create process that is repeatable and scalable. We're also going to talk about acquiring a company a little different. I know we talk a lot of folks about companies that have started from the ground up. In this case, we're going to talk about a company that gets acquired and how do you grow and scale it and change it to meet the opportunities since you available that you see available in there in the market. So I'm excited for this conversation with that. Russell, welcome to the program. It's great to be here. Bruce, thanks so much. Yeah. So why don't we start with a little bit of background. I know that you're a longtime yo're entrepeneurs organization like I am, and that's always an interesting story to hear how people gotten to OEO and that experience. And then I know you were living abroad when this opportunity came up, so I'd love to hear about that. I'd love to hear about how you actually went through the process of deciding to acquire the acquisition process. And then what you've been kind of learning as you've gotten in there and figured out how the company works, where you want to take it, where the opportunities are, where the challenges are. So give us the backstory. Let's hear let's hear about that first.
[00:02:10] Yeah, awesome. And feel free to interrupt me as I'm as I'm running this running through this. As you know, the journey of entrepreneurship is a journey of self-discovery. And so if you had told me that 16 years after starting my first company that I would be in the bookkeeping business, I would've been like, you're insane. But my journey my journey started out pretty traditional. I started out in corporate finance and investment banking. And I went to business school and I checked the boxes. My parents were happy and I was doing some professional things. And then in 2005, I realized my itch and scratched it. And that was the beginning of my entrepreneurial journey where a buddy of mine and I from business school started a health care service business called Rende Medical that operated the sleep clinics. And we built that for five years, not having any idea what we were doing. And then we sold that. And I started a health care technology business that got funded by some insurance plans and built that for another six years and then sold that business. And really, you mentioned know at the beginning the entrepreneurs organization was so amazing for me because I was alone and scared and afraid and trying to steward people's money and building teams.
[00:03:29] And yeah, it needed the support. And so I have a lot of gratitude for the entrepreneurs organization. Well, in twenty seventeen, when we sold the last company, I went to work for the acquirer for a year and it was a year an opportunity to recalibrate with my family and my wife. Like, what are we actually doing as partners? Not just the Russell better ROI to build a business show. And long story short, we after a little bit of coaching from a third party, we converged on this topic that gave us a lot of energy, which was, hey, we've been talking for ten years about living abroad as a family and our kids are going into high school and should do it. Should we go for it and not let it pass us by? We did. And we we moved to Costa Rica and we lived in San Jose a. And it wasn't a sabbatical year. I had to work and our kids went to school. But that moment of popping the bubble of my small world opened up the possibility of possibilities. And I was open until that first business partner. I said I got my first company with, called me up and said, Russell, I've got some really interesting ideas around business process outsourcing and the future of backoffice bookkeeping and accounting and why it needs a leader and you wanna get involved.
[00:04:46] And I said, let's go before it. I love it. But we know we didn't know. We didn't want to build a service business from scratch because service businesses from scratch are really a long slog at such a referral driven business. And so we said our genius zones, our expertise is not so much in starting something from nothing, but it is taking something that exists and layering on systems and process and principles to really take it to the next level. And so we kissed a lot of frogs and talked to a lot of potential companies to acquire and get involved with. And we found this amazing company. And San Francisco, run by a wonderful woman named Becky Brown, who'd been building a business for fifteen years, saw the opportunity to grow virtual back office bookkeeping and accounting, but didn't really have the tools and the expertise to think about it at scale. And I was looking for partners and we were looking for her. And today, we're all equal partners in a business literally closed in August of twenty, eighteen. And in a year we've doubled the business and trying to fortify the platform to continue growing.
[00:05:52] I love it. So lots of questions on the business, but I want to actually go back and just kind of curious.
[00:05:57] And as you've kind of gone from company, company or, you know, gone to gone through the entrepreneur's journey of building and then exiting and company building another one and getting involved in new ones. Any interesting takeaways for you in terms of, you know, what was similar or what was different? You know, what did you learn about yourself as an entrepreneur once you've kind of gone through the cycle once and then actually going through it again?
[00:06:17] What are the what are the things that you felt like? Two mistakes you didn't make the second time. New mistakes you've learned. Any any big takeaways for you as a as a multiple business entrepreneur?
[00:06:27] I have made so many mistakes like we all have. But I'm going to separate those between sort of tactical mistakes and then I'll call it self-discovery. Mistakes and tactical mistakes are somewhat, somewhat unavoidable. It's on the job training. You have a hypothesis. You run an experiment. Some things work. Some things don't. What I have done things different in certain situations or circumstances. Yes. I don't want to bore everybody with those specifics. That's just learning over time. The the self-discovery piece, which is a journey, really comes down to where do I get approval, security and control, sort of the three core elements that drive us. And I think my journey, which I'm still on, is over time. I started out at a place where approval was driven externally, like, am I am I doing the right thing for other people? I wanted to be in total control and I wanted security, like for my family. Oh, is it's going to be a home run or isn't it? Am I gonna make money or take it to make money? And over time, I think I've realized that I'm in more control of that than any external factor. And so when all the crazy and the frenzy exists and building a business day to day, I am on a path of staying more centered in accordance with my standards rather than looking for external validation. I would say that is the greatest learning for me.
[00:08:02] It's an interesting one and I think it's a that's one that I see kind of again and again and kind of in the end the journey of leadership where you work very hard to kind of use external factor as guideposts, you know, feedback to kind of validate, you know, what you're thinking or what you're doing. And as you move forward, you realize the best thing you can do is actually set your own standards and your own guidepost and mature. You are up to those things. Actually, the more effective you are, the more powerful you are and actually the more influence you have over folks as they live your work.
[00:08:29] Yeah, yeah. Live your work. Don't prove your worth. That was the message that I received loud and clear.
[00:08:36] And tell me about the decision to live abroad. I mean, you mentioned that this was not a vacation, right? You were not so on sabbatical. You weren't, you know, checking out and sitting on the beach or what? You know, when you have that kind of change in context, you know, not only kind of culture, but kind of situation and all those things, what were I guess, what were the things that weren't as hard as you thought they might be and things that you thought were going to be easy?
[00:08:56] That was there were not as easy as you thought they might be.
[00:08:59] It was amazing to me that when we made the decision and it was a black and white decision, we are moving to Costa Rica that the universe has a magical way of helping you when you're clear on what you are doing. And so once we were really clear that the connections that the introductions, the the community kind of galvanized around us and made our entry into Costa Rica so welcoming and war. And my wife and I would look at each other literally pray every we can say, oh, my God, I can't believe how this has worked out. But I think it's because we were so black and white. We're so clear now. Right or wrong or regardless of the outcome, we were we were clear. And so that made it that made it particularly easy that the drive to do it was a question that my wife and I wanted to answer around. What is the life we're trying to design? And historically, my life had pretty much been, oh, it's the Russell Ben Ryan business show we're on right now. And so the question was, are we going to. Are we gonna be intentional about designing our life or are we just gonna have it designed for us? And I was having a real problem, Bruce B in my bubble in Seattle and feeling like I had that means a hotspot to. To put my life on a new trajectory and I felt like I needed to have a change of scene and also give my kids that experience.
[00:10:29] Yeah, it's interesting. I run the Salar, you know, successful entrepreneurs there are there, you know, building incredibly impactful, profitable businesses, but they kind of have this kind of philosophy or other they're sucking the situation of sort of deferred gratification or deferred enjoyment where it's like, well, I just I'm going to put another five years or another ten years, you know, and then I'll sell this thing and then I'll be able to have fun or then I'll do what I really want to do. And I think it's so important to figure out, well, you really need to the design life you want now and live the life you want now and figure out integrate those things.
[00:11:00] Because if you you know, if you wait, you know, it's just, you know, you run risk. You just you don't know what your life is going to get to play out. Right. And so, you know, delaying that. But also, I think it just inhibits your success. I mean, I think if you actually figure out how to incorporate the things that drive you that you're passionate about, that gives you energy, it's actually going to make you more successful in the shorter term. And I just I you know, I applaud you for actually taking the time to think about designing the life you want and how to live it. And yet also doing the work that you want to do in terms of building business and engaging professionally. I like the idea of, you know, we need to constantly be taking kind of mini sabbaticals and getting, you know, getting our energy back and then using that to fuel our process rather than feeling like we need to drive ourselves into the ground for 10 years to then realize the success of our effort. But let's get it open.
[00:11:44] It opened my eyes to a phrase that I like called geographic independence. That technology today has enabled us to follow our purpose, our passion from anywhere in the world and achieve our economic means in the enterprise. That's possible today and it's happening more and more. And so the idea that you can live anywhere and still build a great service business is kind of awesome.
[00:12:08] You know? Yeah.
[00:12:09] I mean, it's really I mean, it's it's only kind of practical and or, you know, holistic in the last, you know, five, 10 years with technology or connectivity and things like that. So, yeah. And it certainly is revolutionizing a lot of the service industry because now you're no longer kind of geographically tied to talent and to clients. Right. You can service everyone that you can get to with an Internet connection and you can employ, you know, engage anyone that you can get to with Internet connection. So, yes, there's a good new kind of business world that we live in. So talk to me about the acquisition process. So you mentioned you had to guess a few frogs. You know, you found someone who, you know, was this great fit based buddy. You wanted me because how much did you sit down and say, all right, here are our 15 criteria. Here's what the perfect situation looks like. And then you're just out there trying to fit, you know, shapes to the holes that you had created and figure out who could get the best fit and how much was this kind of a discovery learning process for you
[00:13:00] You know, as you got out there, kind of learn more, figured out more of what you want, iterative process. Tell us about about played out.
[00:13:06] We're not that smart is to be calculated with those parameters upfront. It's a it's certainly was an iterative process. We talked to one company that was a very, very small but we liked the owner. She happened to be in accounting, bookkeeping and accounting for particular vertical. I think it was brewpubs that we're like could be seen. But then we dug in a little bit more and said, oh, I don't think there's enough there. They're there for it for this to happen. And and we learned a little bit more in every conversation, like every conversation stands on the shoulders of the prior one. And it is only when you get out there and have the discussion that you can, in fact, crystallize what it is that's important to you. But what we really realized is that the thing that was most important to us, once we found a profile of a business that would allow us to work on the business and not in the business, that's private. Hilter distinction there, which is is this substantial enough so that we can be business owners and not business producers, not business operators, because so many service businesses we know get capped by the limitation of the owner's ability to be the primary producer. We did not want to be in that situation where business builders were business owners. I am not trying to become the world's best bookkeeper. As an individual. But once we determined that we had the right profile, 90 percent of the discussion was around shared values, shared principles. Can we work through conflict together? Can we speak openly and transparently? Can we operate with integrity? Can we work through the invariable ups and downs till we truly come together as partners? Because the owner of the business wanted to be on a growth trajectory with us? Yeah. So we're like, OK, well, let's make sure we're not going to ride this as a unit, as a team and not find out like most acquisitions happen down the road. Oh, man, we miscalculated on the person.
[00:15:02] Yeah. And that one is hard to recover. I mean, you recover from all all other kind of strategic pivots, you know, make things like that. But if if it comes down to a you don't you don't have the right cultural fit. You don't have the right alignment around where you want to go and the rules that you want to use to get there
[00:15:17] That's tough. I mean, I see a lot of partnerships break down over those. Kind of issues. Talk to us about how you always talk about separating out kind of the partnership alignment versus business strategy and development. Do you have any ways in which you come together as owners, partners and have those kind of discussions around, you know, what do we each want out of this? How are we doing? What's the changes in circumstances like how how do you kind of stay aligned on the same page, connected as partners above and beyond, you know, kind of operators of the business or people that are owners of a business?
[00:15:50] Yeah. Couple of things. First, we are not afraid to start a conversation that includes the owners. And be clear, what hat are we wearing right now in this conversation? Are we wearing owner nuts or are we wearing operator hats? For wearing on our ads, we're gonna have a slightly different way of how we look at the business versus operator hats, which is, hey, we're in the business. There are some real issues we're dealing with, etc. So being clear on that. The second is we established a set of twelve principles for how we behave with among ourselves, with our clients and with our employees. And those principles are widely shared and communicated throughout the organization and embraced and adopted. And those principles which has been a little bit off of Ray Dalia's book principles sure have been very foundational for us. So that as conflict arises, which is going to can we address it in a way that anchors against. How does this how is this in alignment or out of alignment with our principles? And I think we've been able to quell a lot of emotional stress right now of growth with more of a less emotional principles based type of discussion. And that's been really helpful for us.
[00:17:07] Yeah, sorry. Yeah, it does. My kind of work in philosophy is that you can't ignore the emotions, but you need to understand how they kind of hijacked decision making and you know, you need to kind of process them in such a way that gets you into a place where you can you can make good long term decisions, you know, for the benefit of the entire group. And that's I think is great that you've got an actually prescribed written down set of principles and way we could talk about Ray Dalia's principle separately. TER I'm intrigued by the fact that you've done that.
[00:17:38] I think that's a good move in a service business where you have a lot of clients. The importance of separating fact from story is incredibly important. The direction that issues roll downhill in our business comes right to the doorstep of bookkeeping and accounting. Like it's amazing. It's so easy, right? Blame the bookkeeper and the accountant. OK, well, we have to acknowledge that much of the drama that gets created in a client service industry is there are stories that are getting manufactured, manifested in each of our brains, the client's brains and ours that may or may not be really based on the facts. Know very few facts that are driving emotions. But unless we're able to what we call get state in sync, it's one of our principles, by the way, get and stay in sync and have a method of doing that with a client. We know we're just going to be in fire-fighting business all the time. We're trying to build the impossibly perfect machine. Again, another principle, not just a bunch of independent bookkeeper's that are satisfying the unique needs of individual clients. That's not really a scalable foundation.
[00:18:44] And let's talk about what I guess, as you've gotten involved in the business. How have things played out? What has been your areas of focus? I mean, you know, typically I find that, you know, in order to get to sort of next level, you know, size or, you know, strategic position, you have to undo a few things in order to be able to get there. What have you as you got involved, what are the things you noticed that maybe needed to be undone, rethought, restructured in order to achieve the goals that you wanted to achieve with with taking on the business?
[00:19:13] Step one was first, do no harm. So for us to come in and completely rip out systems and process and say, oh, this business is is ugly, it's got all these problems, like that's not what it works for. There was a word or three. So we set our initial objective around an acronym. And as in Mary V, as in Victor S as in Sam MVS, MVS for us was the achievement of minimum viable scale. Minimum viable scale dictated that we wanted to grow the business enough add enough clients over a six month period that the monthly recurring revenue of that business was sufficient for the operators in their functional roles to be sufficiently compensated, as well as having enough capital in the business to start making investments in software and systems that will help create a more flywheel effect for the machine that we went to built with our capital. Right. You can't make the investments in the machine so that so our focus was it was minimal viable scale. The issue in our industry is not do clients accept. It's a problem that they want to solve. No, no, no. Everybody know everybody needs a bookkeeper, accountant. The problem is how do we get clear enough on what our value proposition is and who our customer segment is so that we can be efficient in how we go to market, which is still a bit of a journey for us, quite candidly.
[00:20:37] So then we grew really quickly. We added a bunch of clients and it is at that moment, those moments when you see truly see the worse things break, system break. We saw all the vulnerability and the vulnerability is typically in service businesses. Single point of failure. Oh, no, I lost this individual. They left. What had they been doing? Is anything documented? Who's backing them up? And because the business no judgment, by the way, didn't have those systems in place, that durability. It's now has exposed a lot of the components that we knew we needed to tackle them to some extent. You almost can't tackle them until you truly see them. Now we see them and our theme has moved from MBBS to our theme over the next six months. Company is stabilized. Stabilized is now because we achieved MVS stabilizes now about putting this the systems and processes in place to take that next step function in growth. This is stair step stop. It's not linear growth, it's getting on new new slopes, new planes in a stair step function and we're in a stabilized phase.
[00:21:47] Yeah, well, I like that. I think that when we talk about this a lot in the growth processes that everyone kind of assumes growth is this kind of, you know, geometric linear plan. And so like, you know, there's each. Each step is very smooth and incremental. And as this kind of ramp that I'm that I'm walking up and in fact, it's much more of the stair step model that you mentioned, you know, mainly because there are services, there are just stable levels right now.
[00:22:11] The company works very well at 15 people. Then at 30. Then at 50. Then at 100. And it has to do with, you know, how productive people are, levels of management, resource allocation.
[00:22:22] And oftentimes I find, you know, what happens is companies kind of get stuck in and in between state. And oftentimes these in between states are actually not very profitable or painful or difficult to manage. And without kind of really thinking through what is my next stable version configuration of the company, you know, I will keep kind of trying to grow and then scaling back and trying to grow and scaling back design. It becomes painful. And I think it's smart that you've kind of identified the step function and then moving through those intermediate states as quickly as possible is really important. And I need to, you know, not stay there because I'm going to be losing money. I'm going to be in pain. And the quicker I can get to the next level and this kind of stabilization stuff, like once I get there, I need to stabilize. I need to make things super efficient and I need to hoard cash. Right. There's all sorts of things you can do in these in-between states to then build up your pilate's to sprint to the next level. So I it's really it's fascinating that you've identified that. And I think a lot of companies don't see that night, particularly with services, just as you're dealing with people and organizational structure. And, you know, I think it's a little easier in a product and tech company is to be much more kind of a smooth slope ramp of growth. But, you know, services, it just doesn't it doesn't work that way.
[00:23:27] Well said to you know, one of things I notice is, as you know, companies are kind of looking at strategy. They start learning more about who their best customers are, how they're going to, which products and services they should focus on. Tell us about some of the changes or realizations or things you've kind of had to evolved and shift as as you've kind of grow the business to look at where you should really focus on strategy.
[00:23:46] Yeah. So really three areas. The first is how we distribute work among a a distributed team. So we believe that in order to scale our service business, to do it profitably and increase quality as we grow, we need to break apart the functions of a bookkeeper ers activity and determine what can be done in a less sophisticated or lower cost environment. And reserve the higher value activities to the higher value people. So we've stood up a team in the Philippines. They are employees. They're part of our culture. They're taking on a lot of work right now. But the effort for us as owners is how do we create enough transparency through our system so that we know who is doing what? Where does it stand and how does it get re-assembled back for the client? So that's that's a big, big, big part of our growth strategy, number one. Number two is standardizing the way that we manage our client relationships. And so we've implemented something called shared agreements. The sharing agreement is a dynamic document that we have in build building Google slides. But you could do it anywhere where we are documenting visually how the processes are going to work that which we own and client that which you own.
[00:25:02] So when things arise and you get upset about something because you set this e-mail two months ago and somebody didn't get it and they're confused, we just go back to the shared agreement, say what did we say was the process we agreed to put in place? Where did it break down? How do we need to fix it and keep moving forward? We have a relationship that we're managing. Monthly recurring revenue business. Things are going to break, so we have to have a mechanism to fix them, improve them and continue accelerating as partners. So that's a that's another big win strategy for us. And the third and you nailed it, which is customer segment. Customer segment, customer segment. To be honest with you, we still serve. We have about 120 clients today. We still serve a wide variety of professional service businesses as well as technology businesses. And I'm not quite at the point of saying, oh, we are the virtual back office bookkeeping and accounting firm for marketing agencies. Sure. We have about 10 marketing agency. We serve. But I don't think we were quite there yet. Now we really do want to get there because that will dramatically improve efficiency for us.
[00:26:07] Yeah. No, just the more narrow that's defined, obviously, the easier that the more specific you can make their processes, the better you can train your folks, you know. Easier is to hire and easier to sell. Again, it's it's a hard one, you know. And I think most companies struggle with that.
[00:26:20] You know, they kind of come out of the gate selling everything to anyone, but slowly figure out that's not so scalable, like it's going to be tough to build a business around those.
[00:26:28] But that's so tell me a little bit some things about the tech side, because, you know, a lot of this you know, a lot of the kind of distributed teams and rural workers and things like that, you know, requires this technical infrastructure underpinnings. You mentioned Google slides, but what are some other technologies that you've kind of discovered builds? I mean, how how do you go about this kind of buy versus build process that has enabled you to actually make this possible, given, you know, given the nature of work these days?
[00:26:54] One word, it's a sonna saying it, you know. So Assunta for us has been one of the most revolutionary work management applications that we've ever seen. In fact, Assunta, who wrote a case study on Stride, it's on their site, said your implementation of Assunta is one of the most sophisticated we had ever seen. So here's what that means. All of our objectives are in Asthana, all of our business. Sprint's who's doing what? What their priorities are for the month. How we're tracking it. We on-board and ofthought employees in Asthana. We run all of our meetings in a song that we expose clients to the work plan in Assunta in a distributed team. That level of connection and a factness for communication has been incredible for us. So that's more about how we conduct our selves in a communication framework as it relates to what are the systems that we deploy in service to the clients accounting bookkeeping needs. Here's the thing. We're not a technology company. There are great cloud applications out there. QuickBooks Online build upon expensive İkizce. We're pretty good at stitching those together and 100 percent paper a vehicle, but we're not trying to lock clients in to create some crazy switching costs because we've built some proprietary technology that is not where we're going to add value. We have value in systems and process and people now not in that tech. We want to be a tech company. We don't use it.
[00:28:24] We want to be smart. And tell me about kind of future plans at this point. So you you you're in the kind of stabilization phase, but what do you see in terms of objectives where you want to be in a couple of years? What goals have you been setting and what kind of drives your kind of your operational motivation for the business?
[00:28:42] Yeah, we have a lot of headroom between where we sit today and where we what we think we can achieve specifically in virtual back office bookkeeping in accounting. We believe that headroom so much that recently we decided to stop doing one type of service. We were providing some H.R. services and step back and said, well, on a second. And that's not in our genius zone right now. 2, that's a very different business, even though it feels pretty complementary. And 3, let's play the game that we're in right now, which is focus, focus, focus on the one thing that we really want to be the best in the world. So there is really maniacal focus on virtual back office bookkeeping and accounting. But what we're really building here is a machine of how a service business can grow and scale. And so our energy longer term is thinking about, OK, how can we take this model of how we've approached this business and now can we apply it? Can we get back into the HRR game and take a similar discipline and rigour? Can we get into I.T. services or market services? Are there other ancillary areas of virtual back office process that we could either add organically or add through acquisition to build a more I call like a single throat to choke for a client. So we beat a more comprehensive service provider for them over time.
[00:30:08] Well, I like that idea of kind of picking one area to kind of excel at or dominate, you know, really, really figure out how to get it working very, very well. Well oiled machine and then how. Then how you can go into these other areas and apply what you've learned and the underlying philosophy and tools and technology, so that's great. Russell That was a pleasure of the people. When I find out more about you, about stride, what's the best way to get that information?
[00:30:31] Oh, best way to get the information is to just email me directly at Russell to assist to ALS dot, then away a B and a R away astride dot services. Or they can call me, can I get my number on this? Sure. Go ahead. 2 0 6 7 7 9 1 3 5 9. Happy to connect and go to the web site which is w w w dot stride dot services, which is very important because strides have pretty common names. So strained services.
[00:31:02] I will make sure that the links in everything that you mentioned there are Shona so people can get get that and connect with you. Thank you so much for taking the time. Has a great conversation. I love this story. I love the strategy. I love what you're doing. I'm curious to keep in touch on how things play out. And I appreciate the time today.
[00:31:17] Thanks for doing this, Bruce. Really appreciate the opportunity. Have a great day.
[00:31:22 You've been listening to Scaling up Services with Business Coach, Bruce Eckfeldt. To find a full list of podcast episodes, download the tools and worksheets and access other great content, visit the website at scalingupservices.com and don’t forget to sign up for the free newsletter at scalingupservices.com/newsletter.