Carrie Santos, CEO, Entrepreneurs' Organization
Carrie brings nearly two decades of experience in executive leadership, change management and strategic development of international policy and programs and a strong record of driving operational excellence.
She also recently served as Policy Section Chief, Refugee Admissions at the U.S. Department of State, working on cross-cutting policy issues and new initiatives to improve the refugee admissions program. Prior to that, she worked at the American Red Cross as the Executive Director for International Response and Programs.
https://www.eonetwork.org/
https://www.facebook.com/EntrepreneursOrganization
http://blog.eonetwork.org
https://www.inc.com/author/entrepreneurs-organization
AUTOMATED EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
[00:00:01] You're listening to Scaling Up Services where we speak with entrepreneurs authors business experts and thought leaders to give you the knowledge and insights you need to scale your service based business faster and easier. And now here is your host Business Coach Bruce Eckfeldt.
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[00:00:57] Welcome, everyone. This is Scaling Up Services, I’m Bruce Eckfeldt, I'm your host and our guest today is Carrie Santos. She is CEO of the Entrepeneurs’ Organization for those that don't know. I know we have a lot of EO members. I've been an EO member for a long time, is a global network of entrepreneurs, I think. Forget the numbers offhand. Thirteen thousand some network entrepreneurs across the globe, 50, some 60, some other countries I think now, but really a worldwide organization of entrepreneurs helping each other with their businesses, helping better leaders and communities. And we're going to have a conversation about what's going on in the world right now. Obviously, we're in the kind of the midst of the COVID 19 crisis. The pandemic obviously hip hitting all countries really at this point at various levels. But we're going to talk a lot about what's happening with business, what's happening with entrepreneurs. How are entrepreneurs being affected and also how are entrepreneurs responding to the crisis? I always believe that entrepreneurs are one of the great kind of community leaders and can take action and deal with these kind of things. So I'm excited to have this conversation. I'm excited to find out what we're learning. What we're seeing globally, how the entrepreneurs organization is helping entrepreneurs globally really deal with us, deal with this crisis and hopefully come out the other side of this strong helping build communities and really helping helping us get through this with that. Gary, welcome to the program.
[00:02:14] Thanks for having me, Bruce. This is a really great opportunity to get the word out, as you just said, about what entrepreneurs are doing to really impact this crisis.
[00:02:24] Yeah. So I don't know how much I butchered the stats on the CEO at this point. I've been involved with the organization for a long time and I may not have the most recent ones, but where are we now as an organization in terms of reach, in terms of countries? Give us a little bit of perspective for those that aren't as familiar with, you know, about what it is and how it's organized and from a global organization now what it impacts.
[00:02:43] Sure. I'll try to do it in a quick nutshell. We're fourteen thousand five hundred entrepreneurs around the world. And for those of you who don't know us, it's not for the startup businesses. It's for those businesses that have already achieved a great deal of success, making it over that hurdle of earning 1 million annual revenue each year. And we're in 62 countries. One hundred and ninety eight chapters. We really started as a North American organization, but now we're fully 50 percent outside the U.S. and Canada. So we're growing in Japan, in mainland China, where huge in Europe, in Netherlands and Germany. So it's really, really organization with global reach.
[00:03:24] Yeah. One of the things I certainly appreciate it and my experience is, is that global connection and being able to show up in another country, another city, and tap the network and reach out to others and neatly feel like connection. And I think that's one of the real benefits that this kind of global organization has. And I think in this time, you know, dealing with the things that we're dealing with is a great asset. I'm excited to find out kind of how, you know, is kind of approaching this. What what you've learned. Tell me a little bit about, I guess, your role as CEO. I'm not sure if you ever imagined that you would be, you know, at the helm of an organization like this in a time like this. But tell me a little bit about your role in the organization and what you're focused on as CEO at this point in time.
[00:04:05] Sure. So although we're a chapter based organization and each of our one hundred and ninety eight chapters usually has one or two staff members. I lead 130 global staff. We're trying to support the whole infrastructure. We're creating tools, curriculum, everything that the chapter needs to succeed, as well as supporting our global committees that do like that research and development, the regional councils that support each of the chapters. So pretty small number of staff supporting fourteen thousand five hundred because really the local chapters do a lot of work delivering value and benefit to their members. Right, in their own town.
[00:04:43] Yeah. And so I guess wouldn't it.
[00:04:45] When did this first kind of come on your radar or like when did this first become an issue, something that you saw as something that organization actually needed to start paying attention to or having a plan for? Tell us about how this came up for you as leader.
[00:04:57] Yeah, it was absolutely during the Lunar New Year and the Chinese New Year because that the impact in mainland China was so severe. We really saw it at first as quite a regional issue. So we had staff quarantined. We had members in lockdown. A lot of concern about how our members in China were going to be able. To survive a shutdown of business lock down and how we could reach them with resources, with tools. So in a in a funny way, we kind of had a trial run. I mean, for those people there, it was absolutely terrifying and miserable. But we were very focused on the needs of about, say, three hundred members in mainland China. And we have members in the food and beverage industry who, you know, lost 90 percent of their business over. Right. We also had we have a really Azul's setup in China.
[00:05:54] I don't know if you're very familiar with WeChat, but it is a single firm that you run your life on in China. So we were able to do a members survey really early on and find out how our members were being impacted. And from that survey, we heard right from the start that 58 percent of all our members there said they were facing a significant impact.
[00:06:16] And 17 percent said that 90 percent of their revenue had been impacted. So we knew this was extremely severe. But with that survey, we could also ask what you need them most from us. What are the biggest areas where you want to learn more? And number one, cash flow and cash flow. And the thing is, we have a lot of great resources on cash flow. But we also, based on that feedback, started setting up in Mandarin webinars. In those time zones from key members who are expert in that area, tailoring to every business. They needed. So we started with cash flow. But the second highest need was just, you know, surviving a crisis. People had who had been through crisis. A lot of our members in Japan who'd lived through the tsunami or some really terrible natural disasters then shared their experiences with those members in China. We did that all through interpretation on Xoom, which is kind of incredible. And it really made a difference.
[00:07:15] So what's also interesting, you know, those members are about two and a half months ahead of us. Yeah, you're actually seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. And I can't tell you how much that comforts me. They have another side. They're already saying they can see it. We have half of our members in China saying they think it will be over by April. Wow. Fabulous for them, you know, starting in late January. Done.
[00:07:39] Well, meaning ending my April meeting was that they were gonna be back to more or less business as normal day can be back to business as usual by the end of April.
[00:07:46] And of that 50 percent, I think 30 percent said the end of March. So it's really encouraging. And that watching it develop there where we could be intensely focused on three, 300 at once and kind of helped us build out a tool kit. I think if I knew right away, oh, gosh, you have to help fourteen thousand, it might have been overwhelming. And they really learned a lot that serving them, showing them the survey results and then showing them the webinars we were doing to meet those needs was really effective. So we're getting high ratings. The members there are saying that they're either very satisfied or satisfied with the ways we were able to offer them services remotely in that time period.
[00:08:25] Yeah, it's really it's one of the interesting. I mean, you know, interesting maybe a poor choice of words. But, you know, it's a situation that we're in. You know, we're both here on the East Coast, the United States. I'm I'm in New York yet on Syria. But we're you know, we haven't seen the wave hit yet. Right. Look, we're just at the beginning of this. And that's one of the really odd, eerie kind of situations that I find many of people are I'm talking to that are in leadership positions, running businesses, operating businesses is there's this kind of looming well, it's going to get worse, but we're not sure exactly how much worse exactly when we're trying to predict the crest. We're trying to predict how quickly it's going to recover. And it's interesting to see, you know, that this insight around the around China and how they've kind of gone through this, I guess. How much have you been able to kind of see what might be different for, you know, countries in Europe, countries in the United States in terms of how they respond to it? I mean, what I think we're seeing, you know, obviously Europe is is a bit more advanced. I mean, they're hopefully at a peak or close to a peak. I think in the U.S., we're just getting started. Certainly, you know, New York is is one of the hot zones here. Any differences in terms of how you see people responding or how things are playing out either because of geography, governments, situations, politics?
[00:09:36] I mean, what what are the different sensation? We had a really telling important webinar now almost two weeks ago with our chapter in Italy, which is a new chapter. It's a small chapter and still happens that it's based primarily in northern Italy because that's where sorts of businesses we have are operating. So we had the president of our Italy chapter and president elect do a webinar that was I don't think it was organized in about eight hours. There were one hundred and fifty participants. And now it's been listened to many, many, many more times because they basically were calling out to us three weeks into their quarantine. And that, again, was a really helpful emotional point to see how they were feeling three weeks in. And quite a different approach by the Italian government. You know, in China, because of the way we chat works, the Chinese government actually could monitor very closely your movements and know if you were or were not abiding by the quarantine. And people in China do take the government's rules extremely seriously, as I've heard from our members there in Italy, a different setup. That's not what you would expect. But what was so telling from our members in Italy, where, you know, three weeks in, they were at the point where there was a lot more government regulation. I believe they were explaining that only one member of the House is supposed to leave at a certain time.
[00:10:58] You have a certain purpose. And they were describing a member who'd been fined two hundred euros for getting cigarettes. And the police officer said that wasn't a valid excuse. They were talking much more about the inner motivation to be quarantined. I'm sure you felt the same, but they were talking about we know our hospital is overwhelmed. We know my neighbors down the block died and they were very, very adamant about the social distancing, about staying at home, about really not even going out into the street much because of the real disaster facing their hospitals now. Actually, I don't want to overstate it because they were explaining to us that they do have excellent, excellent health care in Italy. And for people who don't know or don't pay attention, they might not know where they were comparing, you know, the number of ICU beds on Europe, a very, very high standards. And the standards in northern Italy are excellent. But even so, the overwhelm the way the system is know the way the poor doctors and health care workers were being impacted. It was such a good signal for those of us who maybe can't rely on our government to say you can't or you can't do this. But hearing their internal motivation was so eye opening.
[00:12:13] Yeah, yeah. I think that's really the of as this plays out in different countries, it will be a determining how how people respond. Well, first of all, what the government regulations are, what what the government does in terms of setting up, you know, controls and taking measures and declaring, you know, actions and restrictions and then how well people follow them. I mean, we're seeing it play out New York kind of kind of microcosm basis. But yeah, that the whole kind of response, community government response interaction will be quite I think will have a huge impact on how this plays out. Tell me about it. You know, as as you sort of see the business reaction to this. What are the businesses that are clearly kind of more affected, less affected? What are the response strategies that you're seeing from the different types of business leaders, you know, across different cultures and the different industries? Well, what insights do you have at this point?
[00:13:00] Yeah, well, there's no doubt that the first emergency cries came from our members in hotels, tourism, food and beverage events. You know, they're they're absolutely the first to see, you know, their future bookings just dry up overnight.
[00:13:15] I'm thinking of a particular member who, you know, 90 percent of her bookings were gone, really sharing on a lot of group chats. Geez. You know. Any tips for me having to lay off all of my workers today? But she very quickly pivoted to food delivery service. And it's something. It is a start. It's a new way to go forward. And she's based in Chicago where my parents live. And I ordered my parents dinner from her business. You know, just to help with my little piece. But, you know, that's part of it. That usually entrepreneurs, they don't give up. They're just shifting. OK, what's the opportunity? I can fill in this space, and I'm just amazed how quickly someone can go from sort of, oh, my God, I can't believe my business of 25 years imploded, too. OK, let me take the next step and see where this can go.
[00:14:04] Yeah, I always say that entrepreneurs to start a business, you need to be slightly delusional. You know, the chances of success are low, the work that you put into it. But it's also the greatest rate. I mean, I think, you know, entrepreneurs are willing to try things and do things that don't actually appear kind of rational or sane at times. And I think times like this is it's a great strength of entrepreneurship. Right. You can kind of put aside all the craziness and all the drama and all the things that you should that are perfect excuses to do nothing and actually do something, actually kind of take the bull by the horns and saying, all right, we're where whereas their are opportunities. How can I get traction? What can I do today to actually make some progress on something? And I think that's ultimately the real power of entrepreneurs. And I I certainly believe that, you know, it will be one of the major forces and help us to help us get through this and then recover from it.
[00:14:51] This is a group that's not afraid of the economic consequences we're facing because so many members you can talk to them. Well, I was almost bankrupt this year. I lost 90 percent of my business after 9/11. They have seen it before. They know they can get through it. And that kind of confidence. I love working in this setting because it helps me not get down.
[00:15:12] Yeah, it's one of the things I'm personally doing is I hold a happy hour, a virtual happy hour on Tuesdays and Thursdays and I invite all of your friends. We all friends. And we just chat. And it's and it's that kind of energy. Right. It's about how do we. Yes. Recognize the challenging situation we're in, but also where can we find things? We can actually do things. What we can make a difference. Start moving things forward, you know, recognize the situation, but also not let it stop us. And I think that's a huge power for entrepreneurs. Tell me a little bit about some of the businesses that have not maybe been as affected by it as you look across your chapters and your members. Do you notice anything about businesses that seem to be not nearly affected, at least initially here and and in the early stages of this, by that the situation that's playing out?
[00:15:58] Yeah, absolutely. We have businesses and online sales, online marketing.
[00:16:04] And I know they're doing well because they're putting their hands up and offering to members who need to learn how to do online sales and marketing. They're offering their resources often for free, just to help people learn how to operate in a different way. In addition, we have a large number of members that have different aspects of remote work that they handle.
[00:16:26] So either they have, you know, virtual assistants. We have a member in Vietnam who has a work from home platform. He's giving to fellow members of our organization, EOH Teladoc Service. Yeah, offering services around the world. So a lot of our businesses that we're already not brick and mortar have a ton of capacity, a ton of insight. And they're really wanting to help others who who are just going down that journey again.
[00:16:54] And another wonderful part of, you know, just the helpfulness, the willingness for members to help other members and really help other entrepreneurs in general is a great, you know, one of the great core values, I think, of the organization. You know, as you look through, you know, kind of dealing with the current situation and kind of the current crisis and helping people get through this. Looking at kind of the next step and the rebuilding side, anything that you see in terms of things that we're going to need to put in place or or the process that's going to happen once we kind of get through like the wave of of Cauvin, but then the rebuilding process. Anything there that you see needs to be kind of thought about or put in place were invested in at this point so that we can see a strong recovery after this.
[00:17:36] And that that's a good question. I think we should call up our some members from from China and get it. Exactly their advice on how they're getting back on your feet and how it's going, because I haven't heard too much from their side. There was a lot of discussion in China about building really strong employee and staff culture in this period. And I think their hope was that digging in, especially with remote work and everything you can do to build a culture around your core values, it's them seeing that is really the path that is going to help them get to the other side. I think when I think about the messages that that's one that's come up a lot. And I believe they're really seeing that as the way forward as things started to change and improve.
[00:18:19] You can't help but think that this is going to have some irreversible changes to the way we do business or at least think about business or, you know, how we make our businesses more resilient to two things like this.
[00:18:30] I don't think anyone. Someone may have had this in their business continuity. So a small paragraph somewhere there, jump in there. But, you know, this definitely gets us to rethink where businesses are vulnerable, where industries are vulnerable, supply chains, all those kind of things. Tell us a little bit more about what Edo's doing in terms of trying to muster resources, pull together information for its members. How have you kind of activated the organization to help those that are in need? And obviously, this is going to change as different countries kind of get to different stages. But how are you kind of approaching the process of pulling together things for your members?
[00:19:02] Yes, absolutely. So it's interesting. Our members communicate on so many different channels. I just think it's a symptom of our modern era. So we have members who primarily communicate on WhatsApp. We have those who are on WeChat. We have those who are using slack.
[00:19:17] So we're actually engaged in a heavy listening campaign and all of those different, you know, Facebook as well, trying to make sure we hear what members are concerned about, what their needs are and compiling that into like a weekly listening report. So we end up with the latest trends. I myself, when I'm on Facebook and I see something, I cut and pasted into the staff site. So people are keeping up with, you know, what people are talking about, what they're concerned about. Interestingly, we have an online learning platform that, you know, was launched a couple of years ago, a moderate success. But because we're an organization where that in-person meeting was really the critical element, I would say it's probably been under leveraged up to now. So I if we had it in place, we're using the online learning management system to collate and carry the new content that's just come out in the last few weeks. So all the webinars are there. They're all have different hashtags on you. OK, this is for cash. This is for remote work. This is for employee culture. So we have both a prior. Types of information that have been shared in various learning events there, as well as the really new stuff.
[00:20:26] And you can easily go on there and search it. But at the same time, our members, as they were doing different webinars and different learning opportunities for members this week, we pretty much asked every single one, well, is this just for our organization? Or do you want to share it with all entrepreneurs? And the overwhelming answer has been known. We want to share it with everybody. And that that really is this the spirit of our organization. So we're building out on our public Web site resources that we just haven't made available before. We're different. And not just webinars and podcasts, but also written resources. You know, this is what your employee manual can look like. This is what your small business loan application can look like. Also for just businesses at large. And again, we're an interesting, you know, innovative network. So the Seattle chapter and the Atlanta chapter already have public facing resources that anybody can log into now. And I can geographically limited. So we're just trying to pull all that together and share in both ways, because really, your members don't want other businesses to suffer.
[00:21:30] Yeah, no. And I think that correlating bringing that information together is going to be key. I know a lot of the CEOs and the entrepreneurs that I that I work with, you know, quite honestly, they're still kind of in panic mode. Right. And so they didn't get a lot of information thrown at them. And it's just, you know, sorting through it, figure out which stuff I should read, which should or should not read. So having an organization like you just kind of go through and say, hey, look here, here's here's what you need to know. Here's the here's the right information. Here's the best information to follow. It's going to be key as people kind of figure out how to process this and get through it quickly, because, you know, time, unfortunately, is a bit of an element here. Like the longer that you don't take action, you know, the more risky you are. So I think it's great that you're pulling that together. For me personally, I know one of the big elements of my OEO experience was forum groups and kind of the support that that my fellow entrepreneurs gave me through all sorts of challenges that I had, you know, business and otherwise. How how are kind of the forums, I guess, playing a role in this? Have you seen any insight in terms of what forums are doing to help form it out? You know, both within chapters, across chapters.
[00:22:31] Give me a sense of the end for those of you not in a forum tends to be a support group, about six to 10 people from different industries. That is your bread and butter experience. You know, once a month you're going there and really getting great insights into, you know, your your business, your life, your values and so forums. It's interesting. We had been experimenting with virtual forum pilots. In general, it was something that was developed for in-person. It wasn't planned for this kind of thing. It's been around for quite a long time. But we're so glad that we had pilot virtual for because. Absolutely. Now it's no longer a pilot like the mainstream.
[00:23:11] Yeah, exactly.
[00:23:11] And again, going back to the italie chapter, who were three weeks into their quarantine, they said they were talking about their forum experience and they are not all in the same city in Italy anyway. They had been meeting virtually and someone said, well, how is that going for you? I said, fantastic. You know that even when you're busy, even when you're doing that much in your business, you're in crisis. They couldn't believe how valuable it was to take that time to go through me with your forum mates. And then the energy and insights they had to go back and face the next day. And I think probably yesterday or the day before I saw posted on Facebook a chapter in South Africa sharing its coveted 19 forum discussion notes. You know, here's the question that you ask in your forum. Here's the kinds of exercises to do. And that's what I love about this network. People don't wait for me to give them. I just developed the tools. They and others like it. We know it's good. So we'll be posting those South Africa tools, but you can find them on Facebook right now. I'm pretty sure. Facebook and LinkedIn. I'm guessing so.
[00:24:16] Yeah, I'm sure several several formats and platforms will be going out. Yeah, I do think that forum uniform is one of the key experiences of 40 hours. And I think even if you're not a member of yo, you know, anything you can do to connect with other entrepreneurs.
[00:24:30] Obviously, it's good to connect with everyone, you know, family, friends, you know, all those things. But there is something about connecting with other entrepreneurs in terms of, you know, both because they understand what it's like to be an entrepreneur. They understand that it's going to the challenges and the mindset and the thinking. But also, they have always found that everyone else in my world just had a different kind of perspective or understanding or had it was tough to talk about certain things. And my forum, my entrepreneurial group was a group that I could literally bring anything to. So if you're out there and you're not a team member and you're looking to get some support, you know, anything you do to pull together a couple of entrepreneurs, either locally or even, you know, virtually and start talking through some of these things could be extremely helpful. One of the more powerful things you can do, teratoma a little bit about in terms of other suggestions, advice that you would have for your members or other entrepreneurs in terms of. How to kind of get through the coming weeks, unfortunately, probably in the coming months in terms of both the immediate situation but also the recovery side. Anything that you've seen out there, that particularly that's working particularly well that that operators are doing that have been successful that you could share with the audience?
[00:25:34] Yeah, I mean, this may be obvious, but it's so core to how you members think and behave. The self-care part comes up again and again and again that if you're not taking care of your brain, your body, you're just not going to be able to to go through this this crisis. I'm thinking of a member who was first quarantined in Shanghai and then again in northern California. And he was talking about. Yeah. You know, I think I should have started the exercising a little bit sooner and by quarantine. And those are good words of advice. A lot of EO members find that, you know, whether it's meditation, you name it. But that journaling that that self-care is really a critical element that I think, you know, brings, because as much as it's about cash and understand your finances, if your head is not in the game, if your body is not in the game, you're not going to be able to succeed. And I think that's a really strong part of you. Another thing that maybe differentiates us from other kinds of business advice people are seeing online is the giving back.
[00:26:36] That kind of overwhelms me. And I think most of us do feel better when we do something else for it, for somebody else.
[00:26:44] There's a recent example in New Jersey where, you know, everybody in any town is concerned about small businesses, even if you're not thinking necessarily about your members. But we know the restaurants in the cafes and we know they're all struggling on.
[00:26:57] An EO member in New Jersey came up with the idea that people who have some means, people who have some spare cash, should order food takeout from their local restaurants and have it delivered to hospital workers. And I think overnight think get less than a day here is $30000 now in her community. And that's just OK. So maybe her business had nothing to do with either restaurants or hospitals, but she just wanted to find a way to make a difference. No, it wasn't. There are lots of people who would love to buy dinner for people at their hospital while they're saving their local restaurants.
[00:27:34] And, you know, she made it easy for anybody to do in her community. And I'm sure because that was about 24 hours ago, that there are probably five members doing the same thing in their community right now. But, you know, even myself, I find if there's a small piece of your connection, I can do from one member to another member, some small thing I'm doing for somebody else in the day really lifts my spirits. It might be something to think about when when you feel like you kind of come to the end of your net, which is kind of daily.
[00:28:04] I think so. Yeah, I think certainly, you know, I +1 the self-care is certainly something that I've I've practiced and it did kind of one of those things. If you're feeling down, go help somebody else out. And it really does. Not only does it, I think, help you psychologically, but actually does some good. I mean, these things do circle around. You know, it will it will come back to your benefit at some point, you know, sooner rather than later. But it's been a pleasure. If people want to find out more about, you know, how to access some of these resources, potentially get involved in the organization, what's the best way to get that information?
[00:28:35] Sure. So our Web site is e o network dot org e o and e t. Debbie or King Dot al-Araji. And if you go there today and you're not a member, you will see a lot of our resources are behind the firewall for members. But we are as we speak. We've got the up. We're ready to go. We're very close to turn the lights on a new site that will include resources for nonmembers. But besides that, on Facebook, on LinkedIn, you will see a lot of material that are that we are sharing under entrepreneurs. Org, that's for the public. So I know that Italy webinar I'm speaking about has been shared a lot on Facebook and LinkedIn for anybody.
[00:29:16] That's great.
[00:29:16] I'll make sure that the euro and the both LinkedIn, Facebook, all the handles and everything on the show know so people can easily click through and get that information. Keri, thank you so much for spending some time today. I know we're in difficult times. I know this is you know, it's it's a tough time for a lot of people, but I think it's really great that we were able to kind of talk about what's going on and give people some perspective, give people some resources. And hopefully, you know, we can have a follow a conversation in the coming weeks and months and talk about, you know, how everything is recovering and how everything is bouncing back. I know we'll get there just matter of time, but I really appreciate the conversation with had.
[00:29:49] Well, thank you so much, Bruce. It's really been a pleasure to talk even in these difficult times. And we should definitely do a show on the issues of recovering.
[00:29:57] You've been listening to Scaling up Services with Business Coach, Bruce Eckfeldt. To find a full list of podcast episodes, download the tools and worksheets and access other great content, visit the website at scalingupservices.com and don’t forget to sign up for the free newsletter at scalingupservices.com/newsletter.